Talk:Beijing Subway

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English Station names inconsistencies

I noticed some of the official maps on bjsubway.com have changed some English names and the way that Pinyin names are spaced

1) https://www.bjsubway.com/en/jpg.html 2) https://www.bjsubway.com/en/ 3) https://www.bjsubway.com/jpg.html

1 uses the style like "Changchungqiao","Xihuancun","Nanlishilu","West Gate of Summer Palace", "Yongfeng South" while 2/3 use "Changchun Qiao","Xihuan Cun","Nanlishi Lu","Summer Palace West Gate","Yongfeng Nan (S)".

Wonder if someone on the ground could see if these readings seem to be new standard on maps, station signs etc, or if its just a peculiarity of this particular version of the online map?

Matthewmayer (talk) 20:25, 30 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

FYI User:Ramramger and User:Eti15TrSf Matthewmayer (talk) 20:32, 30 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

It looks like the names have all been changed. That means that the articles need to be moved as well. As for map 1, the English version of the official website is completely out of date and should not be used. The Chinese version is always updated. ETI 15TrSF (Chat Box) 23:25, 30 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Agree with Eti15TrSf Ramramger (talk) 05:10, 31 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Have they also been changed on station signboards, inside train strip maps etc? Matthewmayer (talk) 06:35, 31 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Seems at least on the Fangshan Line they have: http://upload.qianlong.com/2020/1218/1608273315620.jpg Matthewmayer (talk) 08:28, 31 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Maybe we could make a master list of all the station name changes here to be able to check more easily if all the renames/redirects are done correctly. I'm also not sure whether for example "Yongfeng Nan (S)" whether the "(S)" should be considered as part of the official English name or not. Matthewmayer (talk) 10:05, 31 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I definitely think the (S) is a part of the name. We had consensus at Talk:Si Hui Dong(E) station that the official new name is going to be the name of the article. ETI 15TrSF (Chat Box) 07:44, 1 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

There should probably be a space ie Si Hui Dong (E) station not Si Hui Dong(E) station if you look at [1] for example it look likes there's a space, and other Wikipedia articles with () generally have a space before Matthewmayer (talk) 10:10, 1 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The official map does look like there is a space. I think there should be a space in the article name when it is moved. ETI 15TrSF (Chat Box) 18:45, 1 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Changes

Here are all the changes I could find for existing stations aside from merely spacing/apostrophe changes like Changchungqiao/Changchun Qiao

East -> Dong (E)

Beiyunhe East
Dashihe East
Datunlu East
Jiaomen East
Liuliqiao East
Sihui East
Tian'anmen East
Wangjing East
Wansheng East
Yancun East

West -> Xi (W)

Beiyunhe West
Chegongzhuang West
Jiaomen West
Tian'anmen West
Wangjing West
Wansheng West

(Liangxiang University Town West is NOT renamed)

North -> Bei (N)

Anheqiao North
Beihai North
Beiyuanlu North
Gaomidian North
Tiantongyuan North

(Liangxiang University Town North is NOT renamed)

South -> Nan (S)

Baishiqiao South
Ciqu South
Dahongmen South
Gaomidian South
Lishuiqiao South
Tiantongyuan South
Wangjing South
Yongfeng South

"gate of X" -> "X Gate"

South Gate of Forest Park
East Gate of Peking University
West Gate of Summer Palace

Other

Tiantandongmen -> Temple of Heaven East Gate
Beigonda Ximen -> Beijing University of Technology West Gate
Fragrant Hills -> Xiangshan
Olympic Green -> Olympic Park
Qinghe -> Qinghe Railway Station
Beijing Happy Valley -> Happy Valley

Matthewmayer (talk) 13:05, 31 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I found ＂S1 Line＂ was changed into ＂Line S1＂ in the official map.Painjet (talk) 14:42, 1 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I personally think the station articles should be moved into the new name. The official map does say Line S1, so the article should be called Line S1 (Beijing Subway). ETI 15TrSF (Chat Box) 18:43, 1 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

English station names inconsistencies, 2022 edition

The Beijing Subway have once again changed their naming conventions :) https://www.bjsubway.com/en/jpg.html

The new rule seems to be pure Pinyin names, dropping the parenthetical English cardinal directions, so Sihui Dong (E) station is now just Sihuidong

Some stations get a suffixed English translation, for example Zhongguo Meishuguan (National Art Museum)

It would probably be good to have a consistent way of dealing with this in the article titles (with redirects from current names).

"四惠东站" should be at Sihuidong station

"中国美术馆站" could be at 1) Zhongguo Meishuguan (National Art Museum) station or 2) Zhongguo Meishuguan station or 3) National Art Museum station

I probably prefer 3 on the basis that if a blessed English translation is provided on the official map that should be used instead of the Pinyin name.

Matthewmayer (talk) 18:53, 2 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

1) or 3) are both okay. Maybe 3) is better, to avoid long titles.Ontosteak (talk) 14:37, 3 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

loop in User:Nryam User:Oscar Wai for their opinion too Matthewmayer (talk) 18:42, 3 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Also Add User:N509FZ.Osmosisum (talk) 10:10, 5 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I prefer to use 2). The station nameplate at the entrance and exit only has pinyin.--Nrya (talk) 10:51, 4 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Station nameplates use both Pinyin and English where an English translation is available, e.g. see https://twitter.com/DavidFengTrains/status/1478185048667201539/photo/1 Matthewmayer (talk) 13:36, 4 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

another on-wiki example for a newly opened station entrance: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Exit_D_of_Yuyuantan_Park_East_Gate_Station_(20211231113450).jpg It's definitely writing both the Pinyin and the English Matthewmayer (talk) 13:49, 4 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

For me, I would like to choose 1), firstly, it follows the station names in the system. Besides, it has its usages in English Wikipedia. Oscar Wai (talk) 11:25, 4 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

"Station" or "Zhan"?

Following the entrance, should we use "Yuanmingyuan Zhan" instead of "Yuanmingyuan Station"?

--Nrya (talk) 03:44, 5 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

As this is English wikipedia, it should definitely be "station" - it should follow English language sources (e.g. if there was a fire at Sihuidong station, the China Daily would write a headline "Fire at Sihuidong station" not "Fire at Sihuidong Zhan") per https://teknopedia.ac.id/wiki/Wikipedia:Article_titles#English-language_titles "In deciding whether and how to translate a foreign name into English, follow English-language usage. If there is no established English-language treatment for a name, translate it if this can be done without loss of accuracy and with greater understanding for the English-speaking reader." Matthewmayer (talk) 03:55, 5 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

It must be "station", not "zhan". Please noted all Tianjin Metro stations actually use "zhan", but their wikipedia article use "station".Osmosisum (talk) 08:03, 5 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I think @Nrya does not use mainland China's social medias like weibo. https://m.weibo.cn/1796216975/4714679102867381 the signs at Dongwuyuan (Beijing Zoo) exits do have English — Preceding unsigned comment added by Osmosisum (talk • contribs) 08:27, 5 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

"Boijing" :D proof we probably shouldnt take the station signs TOO literally! Matthewmayer (talk) 09:55, 5 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

This is correct in official system map as "Dongwuyuan (Beijing Zoo)".Osmosisum (talk) 10:09, 5 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

https://m.weibo.cn/1271954907/4714639033895593 same for the Xinshougang (Shougang Park) on Line 11.Osmosisum (talk) 08:29, 5 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Add Wikimedia images.

Osmosisum (talk) 09:13, 5 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

now support 1) Xinshougang (Shougang Park) station.--Nrya (talk) 12:28, 6 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

So it seems like the most NPOV and general consensus is, for stations that appear on the official map with just Pinyin, use style like Sihuidong station and for stations that include a supplementary English translation use style 1 i.e. Zhongguo Meishuguan (National Art Museum) station - obviously we can also have redirects from Zhongguo Meishuguan station, National Art Museum station, Zhongguo Meishuguan Zhan Matthewmayer (talk) 09:53, 5 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

For those stations with three lines, only the bracketed English part is announced on trains or at stations (for both Beijing Subway and BJMTR), such as Shoujingmao - only "Capital University of Economics and Business" is announced in Line 10's English announcements. Plus, the arrival announcement of Lize Shangwuqu (Line 14) in English is "Lize Shangwuqu Station".--N509FZ (talk) 12:37, 5 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Spoken names are a bit different to written names. There would be no point in *saying* the Pinyin name in the announcement, as it's just the same as the Chinese name they just announced Matthewmayer (talk) 13:47, 5 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I also noticed there are some stations which previously had English names which appear to have dropped them and reverted to Pinyin only on the latest system map, specifically

Can anyone confirm these names were changed on-the-ground, and this isn't just an accidental omission on the system map? Matthewmayer (talk) 19:22, 5 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

For these changes, they would not take place so fast, but they are intentional changes, not accidental, just like Lize Shangwuqu which should have been Lize Business District. --N509FZ (talk) 18:06, 6 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

For reference I created https://teknopedia.ac.id/wiki/User:Matthewmayer/BJSubway2022 with three lists of stations: 1. Pinyin only 2. Pinyin+English 3. railway stations (which may need special treatment to avoid ugly titles like Beijingxi Zhan (Beijing West Railway Station) station

I followed the exact spelling and spacing on the official map as far as I could. There may be minor errors, feel free to correct :)

Matthewmayer (talk) 20:34, 7 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

FYI i am now complete with the article renaming! All existing station articles on User:Matthewmayer/BJSubway2022 are now blue-links using the new 2022 naming. Matthewmayer (talk) 19:05, 6 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Univ. or University?

Minor remaining issue, there are 5 university stations. While the official map abbreviates this "Univ.", Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Abbreviations says "always consider whether it is better to simply write a word or phrase out in full, thus avoiding potential confusion for those not familiar with its abbreviation."

I assume in-train announcements would spell it out properly as University. Should it be for example Renmin Daxue (Renmin Univ.) station or Renmin Daxue (Renmin University) station therefore?

. Matthewmayer (talk) 18:12, 21 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

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