Hello, Jericho347! Welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. You may benefit from following some of the links below, which will help you get the most out of Wikipedia. If you have any questions you can ask me on my talk page, or place {{helpme}} on your talk page and ask your question there. Please remember to sign your name on talk pages by clicking or by typing four tildes "~~~~"; this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you are already excited about Wikipedia, you might want to consider being "adopted" by a more experienced editor or joining a WikiProject to collaborate with others in creating and improving articles of your interest. Click here for a directory of all the WikiProjects. Finally, please do your best to always fill in the edit summary field when making edits to pages. Happy editing! Peaceray (talk) 20:54, 27 November 2020 (UTC)[reply] Getting Started Introduction • Contributing to Wikipedia • Your first article The five pillars of Wikipedia • Simplified ruleset How to: edit a page • upload an image Getting Help Get help at the Teahouse Frequently Asked Questions Where to ask questions Department directory Request administrator attention Policies and Guidelines Neutral point of view • Verifiability • No original research Reliable sources • Citing sources • Content guidelines What Wikipedia is not • Biographies of living persons Manual of Style (Simplified) • Three-revert rule Copyrights • Non-free content • Image use policy External links • Spam • Vandalism • Sock puppetry Deletion policy • Conflict of interest • Notability The Community Community Portal • Adopt-a-user program Assume good faith • Civility • Etiquette No personal attacks • Resolving disputes Build consensus • Village pump IRC channels • Mailing lists The Signpost (Wikipedia's newspaper) Things to do Task Center • Be bold in editing Maintenance • Peer review • Requested articles Join a WikiProject • Translating articles Cleaning up: General • Copy editing • Vandalism Miscellaneous Categories • Disambiguation • Stubs User pages • Talk pages Useful templates • Tools • User scripts

Ciscogate, which you submitted to Articles for creation, has been created.

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ReaderofthePack(formerly Tokyogirl79) (｡◕‿◕｡) 08:43, 2 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Your recent article submission to Articles for Creation has been reviewed! Unfortunately, it has not been accepted at this time. The reasons left by CommanderWaterford were:

This submission's references do not show that the subject qualifies for a Wikipedia article—that is, they do not show significant coverage (not just passing mentions) about the subject in published, reliable, secondary sources that are independent of the subject (see the guidelines on the notability of people). Before any resubmission, additional references meeting these criteria should be added (see technical help and learn about mistakes to avoid when addressing this issue). If no additional references exist, the subject is not suitable for Wikipedia.

This submission is not adequately supported by reliable sources. Reliable sources are required so that information can be verified. If you need help with referencing, please see Referencing for beginners and Citing sources.

 The comment the reviewer left was:

Does unfortunately not pass WP:NACADEMIC

Please check the submission for any additional comments left by the reviewer. You are encouraged to edit the submission to address the issues raised and resubmit when they have been resolved.

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CommanderWaterford (talk) 12:00, 2 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Hello, Jericho347! Having an article declined at Articles for Creation can be disappointing. If you are wondering why your article submission was declined, please post a question at the Articles for creation help desk. If you have any other questions about your editing experience, we'd love to help you at the Teahouse, a friendly space on Wikipedia where experienced editors lend a hand to help new editors like yourself! See you there! CommanderWaterford (talk) 12:00, 2 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I've left a comment on your Articles for Creation submission, which can be viewed at Draft:Andrea M. Matwyshyn. Thanks! Theroadislong (talk) 07:59, 29 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Andrea M. Matwyshyn, which you submitted to Articles for creation, has been created.

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Theroadislong (talk) 07:02, 13 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

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Hi. I have every reason to believe that that Amazon page is wrong and the first publication of Burning Chrome was in April 1986, not October, but rather than argue about the reliability of sources I have to ask, why do you want to put the month in the lead paragraph? This is not at all common. Dan Bloch (talk) 03:38, 7 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I did some digging into that book and several others, trying to better flesh out 'cyberpunk history'. I saw conflicting dates but the few times I saw April, I didn't feel they were as reliable as the ones that said October. It's also trickier since it was a story and a collection of stories and even searches forcing the year, e.g. "1986" still return mixed results. My only motivation is trying to get the history (especially dates) a bit more specific than years. Jericho347 (talk) 03:40, 7 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I'm primarily using isfdb, which in my experience is extremely reliable. That Amazon reference is suspect because it refers to an Ace release in October 1986, and all the other sources agree that the Ace release was in October 1987. The one published in 1986 was Arbor House. Dan Bloch (talk) 04:13, 7 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Neat, will have to dig into isfdb more. Can we put some indication that the month of the release is disputed? At the time of release, obviously not, but 35 years later kind of fascinating. The one thing I keep running into is even when I find a month, definitively, they all seem to default to "the 1st" of the month. I'm sure that is a publishing thing where they print that date, not when it hits shelves etc. I was tempted to buy some older / original copies of this book (and several others) in hopes it would give me a concrete data I could use. Jericho347 (talk) 04:16, 7 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Sure, I guess I could live with disputed.

BTW, support for my "other sources agree that the Ace release was in 1987" claim above: [1][2]. Though they don't say October. I don't remember where I saw that besides isfdb. Dan Bloch (talk) 04:23, 7 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I haven't given it much thought, but I think you're probably right about the 1st of the month being a publishing convention. Isfdb seems to use the "0th". Dan Bloch (talk) 04:24, 7 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I can pretty much guarantee, that the 1st being listed among many sources that you and I both trust, and distrust, is accurate. it is the single most common thing I see... YEAR-MO-01 way too often. And this came up in a project trying to document cyberpunk history, where of course, books are the dominant source. I think a way of disputing publication, and citing 2+ sources that would generally be accepted, is kind of neat too. It calls out the problem with citation, with publishers, and general issue of trying to lock down more precise dates. I've been using Wikipedia since it started, my account is old, but didn't really start contributing until recently. So i defer to you for the best way to document and represent that. Jericho347 (talk) 04:39, 7 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I thought you were going to update this, but I gather you're waiting for input from me. My strong preference is still to remove the month. A publication month (or date) is quite uncommon in articles about books in Wikipedia. A cyberpunk timeline would certainly be neat, but this one date in isolation doesn't serve that purpose.

And I did some more searching, and I'm sure the Amazon date is wrong. Amazon says, "Publisher: Ace; Revised edition (October 1, 1986)", but the copyright page in the Ace edition says, "Ace October, 1987". So Amazon got the year wrong.

I could live with saying "April" based on the isfdb citation (which is for the Arbor House publication, not Ace), but I don't think including both sources with a note is reasonable any more. Dan Bloch (talk) 15:59, 13 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Right if this one page is in isolation. I wish every book had at least month of publication, not just date. Recent entries for books have exact date because it is better documented (e.g. Freedom™) so having more precise dates is definitely a thing when available. That is why I thought if we could find a way to list both and how it was disputed would be neat. That said, if you still feel just revert and remove completely, I will do that. If you like that idea about showing disputed dates (in any fashion), I can come up with ideas for that. Thanks! Jericho347 (talk) 04:29, 14 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I took out the October date and put the April date in the infobox. Hopefully this works for you and we can call it a day. Note that even if the October date were right, the April date precedes it. Regards, Dan Bloch (talk) 18:28, 14 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Definitely! I wasn't married to October at all! I just want more and more accurate data is all. I really appreciate you taking the time to chat about the best solution here. Jericho347 (talk) 04:13, 15 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

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